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Meeting Minutes
Tuesday, May 26, 2009 at 6:30 p.m.
1. Introductions/Roll Call
Commission members present: Steve Gjerdingen, Joan Felice, Jan Vanderwall, Dwayne Stenlund and Jim DeBenedet
Commission members absent: none
Staff present: Duane Schwartz, PW Director
Others present: None
2. Public Comments
None
3. Approval of April 28, 2009 Meeting Minutes
Member Felice moved to approve the minutes of the April 28, 2009 meeting of the Public Works, Environment, and Transportation Commission at next month’s meeting. Member Vanderwall seconded.
Ayes: 5
Nays: 0
Motion carried
4. Communication Items
Rice Street and Highway 36 interchange
Duane Schwartz mentioned there was an open house about the project on May 27th, 2009. 3:30pm to 4:30pm is for businesses in the area and 4:30pm to 6:30pm is for the public.
Project Updates
Duane Schwartz announced there is a bid opening for the Twin Lakes project on June 1st, 2009. Right of way purchase agreements should be completed in the next few weeks. The project should start in July in order to be complete by the end of the year for the Metro Transit Park and Ride.
Member Vanderwall asked if Public Works has received any questions as to why the project is being done. Duane Schwartz responded the only question Public Works has received is whether the road should connect to Fairview.
Duane Schwartz mentioned the Roselawn project began about a week ago. The first phase is to replace utilities. Member Vanderwall mentioned there was a school bus that had difficulty getting through on the street to pick up a student that needs to be picked up right in front of the house. The student missed one day of school because of this. Duane Schwartz asked to be notified if this continues so the issue can be resolved.
Duane Schwartz mentioned the Snelling project has not started yet. When it does start it will only last for two weeks.
Duane Schwartz reminded the commission they tentatively have their annual joint meeting with the City Council on June 29th, 2009
Member DeBenedet asked if the Roselawn project would be complete before school starts in fall. Duane Schwartz answered the mill and overlay and Roselawn Projects should be done by the end of July.
Member DeBenedet mentioned someone had a question about traffic planning for the Twin Lakes project however information about this is on the City website.
5. Bituminous Roadways Proposed Condition Use Permit environmental Recommendation
Duane Schwartz announced Bituminous Roadways have asked for a Conditional Use Permit for outdoor storage relating to an asphalt production facility. This item has been before the Planning Commission and last week went before the City Council. The City Council referred this issue to the Public Works, Environment and Transportation Commission for review at their May meeting. The discussion at the Council meeting was centered on environmental issues specifically the dust, noise and smell. The Council Action was related to outdoor storage not the asphalt plant.
Kent Peterson, President of Bituminous Roadways, introduced the people that came to do the presentation with him. Libby Henderson, environmental consultant for Bituminous Roadways, John Kittleson, Vice President of Bituminous Roadways, and Lonny Preventure with Northmark. Kent started the presentation by stating the proposed site is on Walnut and County Road B2. Kent Peterson mentioned the noisiest operation they would be doing is crushing concrete which is done twice a year. This is done three weeks at a time between the hours of 7am and 7pm. Kent Peterson stated their company is required to abide by the Minnesota Emissions Control Agencies emissions regulations. Each year they get a report that shows how many emissions the plant is putting into the air. All three of the company’s plants have emissions levels below the 50 ton per year limit.
Member Vanderwall asked which of the company’s existing plants is most similar to the one they want to build in Roseville. Kent Peterson answered Roseville plant will produce more than their Shakopee plant but it will have a new technology to produce asphalt at a lower temperature called warm mix. This new technology has already been installed at the Shakopee plant and the Inver Grove Heights plant.
John Kittleson presented the mission statement of the company: To be a trusted and responsible industry leading providing quality products and timely services that exceeds customer expectations while providing a safe and rewarding environment for our employees. John Kittleson discussed the company’s ability to serve the southern part of the metro area with the existing plants and the desire of the company to serve the northern part of the metro by opening the plant in Roseville.
Member Vanderwall asked to verify if the asphalt needed to be heated to such a high temperature. John Kittleson answered it is necessary for workability purposes of the asphalt. Member Felice asked if the asphalt is heated to the 260 degrees that is necessary for workability then are the other volatiles heated to this temperature also. John Kittleson answered yes they are.
John Kittleson explained why there would be no smoke or odor coming from the plant proposed for Roseville. Light oils are either put in asphalt or left in asphalt during refining. These light oils boil at above 285 degrees Fahrenheit. By mixing at below 285 degrees Fahrenheit, the boiling point is never reached thus eliminating smoke and odor. Warm mix asphalt uses 14% less fuel due to 50 degrees Fahrenheit lower temperature. It produces less volatiles and can use more recyclables.
Member Felice asked how the process uses less energy. John Kittleson and Kent Peterson explained the new warm mix process heats the asphalt at a lower temperature and the water is added to the mix in a different form to change the viscosity of the mix. Member Vanderwall stated he wants to hear more about the moisture when they talk about outside storage. Member Gjerdingen asked if this lower temperature mix is going to be standard and if customers have noticed a difference. Kent Peterson answered he has talked to MN DOT about this and will present this product to them. Kent Peterson also stated they have received good feedback about the product.
A member asked if there was a savings to the customer. Kent Peterson answered yes since this warm mix process uses less energy.
John Kittleson concluded the presentation by stating a 10% reduction in carbon monoxide, carbon dioxide and nitrogen dioxide has been identified. Greenhouse emissions have been reduced. There has been a reduced reliance on imported oil and an increase in pavement life expectancy.
Member Vanderwall asked what percentage will reliance on oil go down when switching from hot mix to warm mix. John Kittleson answered the energy savings has been 10 to 15%. Member Vanderwall asked if that can be measured in their business. Kent Peterson answered yes it is directed related to the amount of fuel that is used.
A video from Bituminous Roadways was shown to review the facts that were just presented about the new warm mix process of producing asphalt.
Member DeBenedet mentioned he took a tour of one of Bituminous Roadway’s plants but not much was going on at that time.
Member Vanderwall asked where the concept of warm mix originated. Ken Peterson and John Kittleson explained this came from a company in Europe. Bituminous Roadways is the only company in Minnesota that is using this technology. Member Vanderwall asked for some documentation from a plant that has been using this technology already. John Kittleson stated the energy saving information he stated earlier. Member Vanderwall explained what he is looking for is documentation showing the specific numbers of energy savings of a warm mix plant versus a hot mix plant.
Member DeBenedet reminded the commission what the Council asked them to do was to review the outside storage of the plant and that there is a time line of 60 days which is up in July.
Member DeBenedet asked what percentage of asphalt will be brought in by rail versus truck. Kent Peterson answered right now 100% would be brought in by truck but they anticipate this would change to 25 % coming in by rail. Member DeBenedet explained he is asking this because of the issue of whether Walnut Street is able to handle the truck traffic. Member DeBenedet asked what percentage of aggregate would come in by rail. Kent Peterson answered it would be about 25% as well. Member DeBenedet asked how much recycled asphalt would come in by truck. Kent Peterson answered 100% would come in by truck.
Member DeBenedet asked how dust would be controlled. Kent Peterson answered this is controlled with the use of water by contractors they use. Member DeBenedet asked about a comment made in the video about being able to double the surface covered using warm mix instead of hot mix. Kent Peterson explained the warm mix increases the amount of time they are able work with the material so they are able to haul it further distances.
Member DeBenedet mentioned his concern about the on site liquid asphalt storage and containment systems. Kent Peterson explained they have a containment system that is built to hold 110% of their largest tank. The tanks are within concrete containments. Member DeBenedet asked if they will be required to infiltrate some of their storm water on site. Kent Peterson answered their engineer has designed the site but he has not submitted for an application yet.
Member DeBenedet proposed that there not be infiltration from the site.
Member Stenlund asked if instead of infiltration of the water, perhaps it could be reused to control the dust during production instead. He also asked for a Material Safety Data Sheet on what is in the dust that is produced, where do they get water from and where do they get lead from. Libby Henderson answered the lead comes from natural gas. Member Stenlund asked if they will be looking at new materials. Kent Peterson answered they have looked at porous pavement. Member Stenlund asked about the material that is left on the road from the trucks that leave the site. Kent Peterson answered there will be daily sweeping. Member Stenlund explained in other states there is a wheel wash out system to wash the trucks before leaving the site. John Kittleson stated washing the trucks is a possibility 5 to 10 years in the future.
Member Felice asked how noise will be contained. Kent Peterson answered the truck drivers will be asked to not bang the trucks. People around the plant will be able to have a normal conversation with the noise coming from normal operation of the plant. The noise generated by the concrete crushing done twice a year would not be louder than the traffic from the highway. Duane Schwartz asked what time of year the crushing would be done. Kent Peterson stated it would be done in spring and fall.
Duane Schwartz stated having a Bituminous Roadways plant in Roseville would save about $5000 to $10,000 per year on maintenance costs and has potential for savings for construction projects.
Member DeBenedet mentioned his concern about the noise from loaders backing up and asked what time of day this would be happening. Kent Peterson stated there are ways to deal with this noise like having a camera on the back of the truck instead.
Member Gjerdingen asked about the traffic numbers on Walnut Street. Kent Peterson answered that 65% of the traffic would be going south and 35% would be going north.
Member Vanderwall asked if there were any non-Roseville residents near by the site. Libby Henderson answered there is not. Member Vanderwall asked about the dust from the plant when it rains. Libby Henderson and John Kittleson explained it would be minimal. Member Stenlund stated there could be something in the runoff and that should be filtered out and stay on the site.
Member Vanderwall asked if the machines that are used for the concrete crushing are on the site or if they are brought it. Kent Peterson stated they are brought in and they could be positioned in the stock pile area to contain the noise. Member Vanderwall suggested the crushing happens during rush hour times to minimize noise.
Member Vanderwall moved to recommend approval of the proposal of the site with the following recommendations:
1. The City be provided Material Data Safety Sheets for all materials used that require this documentation.
2. Recommend working with the Watershed District on a storm water plan for the site that doesn’t include infiltration.
3. Consider storm water reuse for dust control and tire tracking control with tire wash off system.
4. Create a noise control contingency plan that would include back up alarm mitigation. Consider alternative’s if allowed by OSHA such as camera systems or lights. The plan would include no banging of truck tailgates.
5. The City of Roseville may require a future study of ways to mitigate dust if initial control plan is not effective.
Member Stenlund seconded.
Ayes: 5
Nays: 0
Motion carried
6. Illicit Discharge Storm Water Ordinance
Duane Schwartz announced the need to have an ordinance for illicit discharge storm water as a part of the Storm Water Pollution Prevention Program. Member Vanderwall asked to have the word inspect or investigate added to the ordinance. Member DeBenedet asked if the Erosion Control ordinance could be combined with the illicit discharge storm water ordinance into one storm water ordinance. Duane Schwartz stated Erosion Control falls in the zoning ordinance and storm water is Public Works.
Member Stenlund suggested having a guide with pictures for the public to know what illicit discharge is.
Member DeBenedet mentioned how threatened discharge that presents a danger is defined and how should it be dealt with. Duane Schwartz mentioned the enforcement of this needs to be defined.
Member DeBenedet asked to review ordinance at the June meeting.
7. Storm Water Treatment Credit Policy Review
Duane Schwartz announced a need to determine at what level someone gets a credit for storm water treatment. Member DeBenedet asked is it fair for a new applicant or for someone redeveloping a site to get the credit just for complying with the regulations. Perhaps a couple of case studies can be done to research who benefits from this credit.
Member Vanderwall mentioned the Rainbow site where they spent money to treat their storm water, they received a credit. This situation has set a precedent for other situations. Duane Schwartz asked if someone has exceeded the City’s goals does that warrant a credit or can someone just meet the goals and qualify for credit. Member Stenlund stated there should be no reduction for someone that just meets the goals.
Member DeBenedet mentioned there should be a maximum of how much can be credited. Member Stenland mentioned there should be more of an incentive.
Member DeBenedet suggested that this subject be tabled for further research.
8. Agenda for Next Meeting on June 23, 2009.
- Topic for Joint Meeting with City Council
- Rice Street Interchange Noise Wall
- 2010 Public Works Budget
- Organized Waste Collection Reports
9. Adjournment
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